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the opposite of what obama claims he's going to do. that is he's lowered taxes and closed budget deficits. but i actually find the trust argument very odd. because president obama promised that we would have 4.2% economic growth right now.wo we have 2%. he promised an unemployment rate that would be far below where it is today. he hasn't delivered on his promises. on the issue of trust, what is going on with regard to libya? i mean here we have an extraordinary thing where the president comes out on friday and says i directed that everything possible should be done to aid our embassy under attack. that attack went on for seven hours, we now know that secretary of defense saying he denied requests for help over that seven hours. where is the leadership. it's a trust issue. >> on the economy, how does it tip the scales, david brooks and ej dionne in the final nine days? >> i think this has been the worst campaign i've ever covered. i think they're both ending on the same note they started. obama is doing a negative campaign, he's got an ad out which is called "remember" which is about romne
. said he's all about fighting for the middle class. says he cut taxes for everybody. and ask something from nobody, but the problem is we heard those promises before. keep in mind, governor romney lives a few miles south of here in the state of massachusetts. love massachusetts. [ cheers ] but during governor romney's campaign for governor down there, he promised the same thing he's promising now. said he'd fight for jobs and middle class families, but once he took office, he pushed through a tax cut that overwhelmingly benefited 278 of the wealthiest families in the state and raised taxes and fees to middle class families to the tune of $750 million. does that sound familiar to you? when asked about this, he says these weren't taxes, these were fees, but keep in mind, there were higher fees to be a barber, higher fees to become a nurse. there were higher fees for gas. there were higher fees for milk. there were higher fees for blind people who needed to get a certificate that they were blind. he raised fees to get a birth certificate which would have been expensive for me. [ applause
has paid much attention. but unless nothing is done before january 1st, we are going to see taxes rise on most people because that's the end of the payroll tax cut that president obama and congress agreed to. that also means that the end of the bush tax cuts, not only for people over $250,000 of income, but also everybody else who were to some extent, their taxes were also reduced by the bush tax cut. the alternative minimum tax, that also would kick in. there's no alternative to the alternative minimum tax on the table. so you have the typical family after january 1st seeing a tax hike in the range of $1500 to $3500 for the year 2013. now, i expect congress is going to do something, if it doesn't act before january 1st, it's probably going to act sometime in january and then make what they do retroactive to january 1st. >> all right. looking at the long-term and the short-term. we're going to know what those jobs numbers are tomorrow. great to see you, as always. thank you. >> thanks, thomas. >> so just to point out again, we are awaiting for live remarks from the president as he dise
to nothiprognosticati melber, neera tanden, kate ton dawson. let's start with the tax plan. if there is something i believe mitt romney is invested in doing, it is the tax plan. he claims it is revenue neutral. >> you have to claim certain things. this goes for both sides. there is this thing called business cycle. this is what we study. in a free market economy, recessions and recoveries, upswings and down swings are part and parcel of the world we live in. when you look at how budgets are proposed, off of the congressional budget office projection. they are not that realistic. in 2014, 2015, 2016, they are projected real gdp growth of 4.4%. sounds pretty good. how realistic is it? if you take a look at reality, what's happened since the beginning of the century? gdp has grown at 1.7% and we know we are in a pretty sluggish economy. there is a huge disconnect between what's proposed and what's going on outside this window? >> that's the big deal. the claim is, i'm going to go in and cut taxes. don't worry, cutting taxes is going to be stimulative. we are going to end up with way more jobs and ther
. >> joe biden responded to romney this way today. >> called it territorial tax. it's the bain way. it means if you're going to build a factory you go find -- this is the fact. you go find a currentory with the lowest tax rate and the cheapest wages. build it there, pay those taxes and you never have to pay a penny in tax in the profit you make when you bring them back home. why would anybody build -- why would anybody build a factory here? ladies and gentlemen, the experts point out, that new territorial tax will create 800,000 jobs. all of them abroad. i'm not making up, all of them abroad. 800,000. i found it fascinating at their convention when governor romney said the first thing i will do when i'm elected president, i will take a jobs tour. it's going to have to be a foreign trip. >> joining me now ezra klein and eugene robinson. it was a strong week for the conspiracy theoryists about the unemployment numbers. first the theory was that the president would use hurricane sandy and its effects possibly on washington, d.c. as an excuse for delaying the jobs report until after th
wall on taxes, and christie was put on national television and christie quickly realized he doesn't want to be making excuses for mitt romney not releasing his taxes. it's going to go over horribly in new jersey. doesn't look good, period. it was christie much all people who said, you know what, mitt romney should release his taxes. we've seen this a few times from christie. his brand is dependent on being seen as a bipartisan guy. you can't do anything in this situation except working cooperatively and praising president obama if you're going to be a bipartisan guy. >> let me go to another point here. while i'm talking about romney, steve, he very clearly said that fema -- last year he said fema could be privatized or handled by the states. today he wouldn't even answer questions about it. "the new york times" editorial board slammed romney for his position on fema today writing disaster coordination is one of the most vital functions of big government, which is why mitt romney wants to eliminate it. does mr. romney really believe financially strapped states would do a better job
the totally unimpeachbly nonpartisan and widely respected tax policy center did a report that concluded that mitt romney's tax plan would be great for rich people, and would hurt everybody else, the romney campaign's response to that was to go guns blazing against the nonpartisan tax policy center. just attacking them as an institutions. you don't like the message, shoot the messenger. last month after the bureau of labor statistics announced that the unemployment rate was going down, do you remember what the response was on the right? the right started attacking the bureau of labor statistics, as if they were the problem, because they said the unemployment rate was going down. it used to be that democrats and republicans would argue about how best to deal with some factual thing, some problem facing the nation. now, republicans do it differently. they do it differently than everybody else. this is not a mirror image problem on both sides. republicans do a specific thing. they refuse to acknowledge that a factual thing is a factual thing. and this phenomenon on the right, that we got so
new level last week when it was revealed that a nonpartisan tax report was withdrawn by a federal agency because republicans protested its findings. the federal agency in question here is the congressional resource service. they're kind of the gold standard. congress's internal think tank. members of congress have a question about policy or issue, they look into it for them and they issue a report in response to a member of congress asking for that report. the congressional research service is as nonpa parpartisan gets in washington. and a little more than a month ago, they issued a report on tax policy. they found there is no connection between lowering the tax rates on millionaires and billionaires and creating economic growth. there's no evidence that if you cut taxes on the rich that that makes the economy grow. that's a problem because that is essentially mitt romney's whole reason for living. this is the republican party's economic reason for existing. if you cut taxes on the rich, the job creators, that will jump start the economy. this is the whole basis of the party' econ
i hear mitt romney talk about his economic agenda, it's all the supply side tax cuts and that will do more harm than good. >> hold on, jared. >> we got to go. much as i would love to hear you debate that, we have to go. jared, you make me feel better. you'll be back. peter, we'll see you around. experts expect the cost of hurricane sandy to top $60 billion when you add in lost business and property damage. it is day four without power for 3.5 million people across parts of long island, new jersey and new york city. residents are facing widespread gas shortages, many waiting in lines for hours, three to five hours to fill the tank or get fuel for generators and many can't fill the tank. even tree companies are putting jobs on hold because even they can't find enough gas to fuel their equipment. frustration is mounting in staten islands where residents say they're being ignored. that's where richard liu has been talking with survivors. why do they feel ignored throughout in staten island? >> reporter: toure, day five since hurricane sandy has hit, and they're asking the
banks, that's not change. >> and we need real change. >> another $5 trillion tax cut that favors the wealthy, that's not change. >> president obama has tried to convince folks that these last four years have been a success. >> by the way, when you try to change the facts just because they're inconvenient to your campaign, that's definitely not change. >> he wants to take all the ideas from the first term, you know, the stimulus, the borrowing, obama care, all the rest, and then go back and do it all over again. >> you may be frustrated sometimes at the pace of change, but you know what i believe. >> we're four days away from a fresh start, four days away from the first day of a new beginning. >> you know that i'll fight for you and your family every single day as hard as i know how. you know that. >> we've got joy. >> i was going to answer that. >> joy reid. my new friend and my old friend. thank you both for joining us. everybody knows the stakes are enormous. it is how people react over the weekend. that's signals aren't just where they're at, they're being radiated on the nigh
deficits and debt under control. the good thing is there's a forcing mechanism. the bush tax cuts end at end of the year. we have the sequester looming. that wouldn't be the right way to do thing, takes a machete to something as opposed to a scalpel. after the election both democrats and republicans say this is something the country wants to solve. if i've won, then i believe that's a mandate for doing it in a balanced way. >> congresscomwoman if the president wins will they have to budge to raise taxes for the super wealthy to take care the debt? >> i think it's interesting to listen to his comments. basically the president's ideas on how to deal with an economy are an empty binder, if you will. we have brought forward item after item and suggestion after suggestion and bill after bill. we've passed bipartisan legislation in the house, and the senate won't take it up. what we need to do is make certain that we extend the bush tax cuts. we also want to go about closing some of the loopholes and primarily we have to cut federal spending. federal spending is completely out of control an
, perhaps, in damages. that's an extreme weather tax that's going to have to be paid rather than trying to avoid the worst consequences, which would be a much better pathway. >> there are other politicians who have brought this up. let me play a couple clips from the last few days. >> anyone who says there's not a dramatic change in weather patterns i think is denying reality. i would like to say that this is probably the last occurrence we will have. i don't believe that. >> what is clear is that the storms that we've experienced in the last year or so around this country and around the world are much more severe than before. >> so if this is just the start, if it's going to be more of the same, what is your priority short term, and what do we need to be looking at long term? >> well, the american people, they're concerned about mother nature. the republicans, mitt romney, they're concerned about the oil companies that are largely fueling the independent expenditures which are going into this presidential race. this frames the election on tuesday very well. on the one hand, mitt romne
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measures, these are really tough. the first one. temporary taxes to fund education. that sounds great. guaranteed local public safety funding initiative. it's a constitutional amendment. i don't feel that i should be amending the constitution. it says it increases taxes on earnings over $250,000 for seven years and sales taxes by one quarter cent for four years. how much does it increase taxes over $250,000? >> it's a graduated scale. a little bit 250, more for 500, more over a million. >> that's not even in here. >> i'm giving you the answer. >> how are voters? >> this is the voter guide. >> it's in that? the phone book version. >> i brought that for you. in fairness this is printed front and back. i have it printed one side of the page. it's about half this side. but if you go through it, all of that is explained. >> it's just unbelievable. >> here's the deal. arnold had a temporary tax that as compared when he left off. >> i have no problem with taxation -- >> you and i will pay more, the average guy will only pay 1/4 of a cent on sales tax. >> my instinct is to vote for it. >> thi
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tax cut that favors the wealthy, that's not change. >> president obama has tried to convince folks that these last four years have been a success. >> by the way, when you try to change the facts just because they're inconvenient to your campaign, that's definitely not change. >> he wants to take all the ideas from the first term, you know, the stimulus, the borrowing, obama care, all the rest, and then go back and do it all over again. >> you may be frustrated sometimes at the pace of change, but you know what i believe. >> we're four days away from a fresh start, four days away from the first day of a new beginning. >> you know that i'll fight for you and your family every single day as hard as i know how. you know that. >> we've got joy. >> i was going to answer that. >> joy reid. thank you both for joining us. everybody knows the stakes are enormous. that's signals aren't just where they're at, they're being radiated on the nightly news, this program, everywhere. aren't you impressed by romney who is often very stiff and overdressed, never unbuttons his tie, more dressed up than
and myself. and i need [ inaudible ]. >> he's going to cut everybody's taxes 20%, and how are you going to pay for that? we just were told the debt was the biggest problem. if you have a hole to fill, would you dig it deeper before you filled it? >> president clinton and mitt romney still out on the trail today firing up crowds across the battleground states trying to keep their supporters focused on the upcoming election while national attention turns to sandy and the steady progress and joining me for our daily fix is chris cizilla and managing editor of post politics.com. and chris, while this is a complete alteration of the campaign, you've got mitt romney canceling -- one more event in iowa and then cancels tonight in wisconsin, cancels all of tomorrow as does paul ryan. and they have to adjust to, you know, what is the right tone, how do you handle campaigning in the midst of this national disaster? and the president dropping everything and heading back. >> it's -- it's an amazing thing, andrea. obviously there are broader concerns here than the political ones. on the political fr
was that he favors a progressive tax policy, taxing those at the very highest rungs of income a little more to provide a little more help to those on the bottom rungs. "the des moines register" has now abandoned that as a reason for choosing a president. the editorial board has abandoned it in favor of this lie. there is not a lot of difference between the two candidates' short-term economic plans. four years ago, one of the biggest reasons "the des moines register" gave for endorsing president obama was expanding health insurance coverage to more americans will lessen the threat that illness will bring financial ruin. four years later, health insurance is not mentioned in their editorial endorsing the man who promises to repeal the obama expansion of health insurance that "the des moines register" advocated. another important reason cited four years ago in endorsing president obama was the supremely important reason of supreme court justices. obama promises to appoint justices with an expansive view of constitutional rights and equal justice. mccain's appointments more likely would continu
federal taxes to accommodate that cut. the states would then have to raise taxes in order to pay for the replacements for what fema used to do. taxation on the average homeowner or individual -- >> cut taxes so the localities have to raise taxes. >> that's right. >> any way the tax is going to go down. the other scenario, say the states try to replicate what fema does, that's extremely inefficient because what fema can do is keep a lot of resources in place to target wherever the disaster goes. if every state has to act like sandy is going to hit them every time. >> right. >> that's fantastically inefficient and someone like romney ought to know that of all people. >> a lot is give money to states. there's a level of the game here. >> that is what they do. the big obviously the cops and e ems and firefighters are out there, not federal employees for the most part. >> that's right. >> and those are local workers who like are out there, you know, doing the work first. >> ezra, we know if the sequesters go into place, fema loses $878 million, that's a lot of money although we don't
of taxes. everybody's been talking about these swing states as if the tail can wag the dog. somehow if you win the swing states, you affect the whole rest of the country in doing so, when that's the residue. but if you spend all your advertising money and all your grassroots, all your social media, and you focus it all on ohio, that doesn't help you win in pennsylvania. it doesn't help you in minnesota or michigan. i'm wondering whether they got the thing wrong, possibly, the obama people, by putting all their faith in winning those seven states, or most of them. what do you think? >> i think that because of the electoral college, elections, presidential elections have to focus on swing states and have to focus on these emerging purple states, because as it turns out, the elections sometimes do hinge on them. this election does seem to hinge on these particular swing states. the reason why the polling is so confusing, chris, is because sometimes national polls don't take into effect the fact that we have an electoral college, don't take into effect that some of these swing states will be s
budget and tax plan. he's refused to say if he supports the lily ledbetter fair pay act for women. he's refused to say if he would enter one-on-one nuclear talks with the iranians. he's refused to answer questions relating to richard mourdock's rape comment. and finally, mitt romney has actually refused to go on nickelodeon and answer questions from children. now, if mitt romney can't answer questions from 5-year-old kids, how do you think that's going to play with the national press corps? and isn't it interesting that fox news can't even get an interview with mitt romney right now? for more, let's turn to congresswoman debbie wasserman schultz of florida. she's a chairwoman of the democratic national committee. chairwoman, good to have you with us tonight. it's a very strange strategy, being played out by mitt romney. what do you make of it? >> well, i think what this boils down to is a matter of who do you trust? i mean, we know that there is a very stark contrast and a clear choice in terms of the two directions that we could go. but, i mean, time and again now, we have examples o
, we've also got to ask the wealthiest americans to go back to tax rates they paid when bill clinton was in office because, as long as i'm president, i will never turn medicare into a voucher to pay for another millionaire's tax cuts. i will never allow the nation to be plunged into another battle over health care reform just so insurance companies can jump back into the driver's seat. and i will never allow politicians in washington to control health care choices that women should be making for themselves. so, wisconsin, we know what change is. we know what the future requires. we don't need a big government agenda or a small government agenda. we need a middle class agenda that rewards hard work and responsibility. we don't need a partisan agenda. we need a common sense agenda that says, when we educate a poor child, we'll a. be better off we need a vision that says we don't just look out for yourself. we look out for one another. we look out for future generations. and we meet those obligations by working together. that's the change we believe in. that's what this election's all.
. and it will be more of the same. mitt romney has no plan for taxes. he can't be direct on that. he has no plan when it comes to repealing obama care and what he's going to replace it with. and what about immigration? which in these last few weeks hasn't gotten a whole lot of attention. he has no plan for america. and now he's going to be the guy who's going to reach across the aisle? get your cell phones out. i want to know what you think. tonight's question. who do you trust to work with the other side? text "a" for president obama, text "b" to mitt romney to 622639. always to our blog at ed.msnbc.com. we'll bring you the results later on in the show. joining me tonight, karen finney, msnbc political analyst and former communications director of the dnc. karen, good to have you with us tonight. >> good to see you, ed. >> this is -- this is a rather interesting closing argument that mitt romney is making that he's going to be the guy that's going to reach across the aisle. when that really is the last thing his party wants him to do. how's this going to work out? >> also you know what, ed, i think
the de jour, reconvenes a week later, bush tax cuts expire december 31st, the viled sequester kicks in on january 2nd, the debt ceiling wit need to be raised in mid-february and the current funding expires march 27th. bipartisan will certainly need be needed but -- certainly be needed but when will it come? >> romney is more of a flexible flopper than obama he has more influence over the intraj gent element in the ecase house republicans. he's likely to get big stuff down. or to paraphrase mitt's tiger blood will enable him to be more bipartisan because he doesn't believe in anything but winning. joining the panel, authors of the book "it's even worse than it looks" a great read and an important read, senior fellow at the brookings institution, thomas man and norman onstein a collar at the american enterprise institute. always a pleasure to have you on the show. >> great to be back, alex. >> thomas or actually norm, why don't we start with you on this. in terms of the david brooks endorsement or making the case for a mitt romney being the guy to get stuff done, how likely do you thi
, obama's first term delivered an ambitious domestic agenda, with tax, spending, health care, and several rights policies that benefited black americans more than recent administrations in either party. just usually without making a sound. >> uh-huh. >> now, the narrative that i've been hearing for some time is that this president has been silent on the issues of race, and actually has not been helpful to african-americans. you say the exact opposite. >> it is a narrative that's out there and there are some very respected voices in african-american sbel chul circles who have raised that which part of what i was doing is making that argument and looking at the policy. we were speaking about this before just coming on air. if you look, for example, at the people in the lowest fifth of income in this country, barack obama's tax policies and stimulative policies have cut their taxes more than any other administration in 30 years. and if you then look at that in the context of african-american communities for a range of reasons are more -- >> the lower fifth. >> -- moreover represented in that
early. here are the ones that came up. >> number six, if you vote early you don't have to pay taxes. >> looking to mingle? find that special someone in the early voting run. >> the number one thing about voting early, ladies and gentlemen. >> honest, don't you want this election over with already? wooohooo....hahaahahaha! oh...there you go. wooohooo....hahaahahaha! i'm gonna stand up to her! no you're not. i know. you know ronny folks who save hundreds of dollars switching to geico sure are happy. how happy are they jimmy? happier than a witch in a broom factory. get happy. get geico. fifteen minutes could save you fifteen percent or more. >>> we think today is the day that president obama and governor romney will come closest to each other before election day. they'll be about 100 miles apart on the campaign trail in ohio. the president is trying to make up for lost time scheduling three stops in ohio over the next six hours. msnbc's chris jansing is live for us today at the first stop in hilliard, ohio. and, chris, i believe you're an ohio native so -- >> i am. >> if i'm not mista
authorities have signed an executive order that weighs state requirements fuel tankers register and pay a tax before unloading, that's supposed to expedite things and the obama administration has issued a temporary blanket waiver on the jones act which will allow additional oil tankers coming from the gulf of mexico to enter the ports up here. recall this was a big deal during katrina. the jones act requires all vessels carrying products between u.s. ports to fly under the u.s. flag, be built in the u.s., and be crude mostly be u.s. citizens the fact they're waiving that will hopefully expedite more fuel in here. what are they doing on the ground? trying to get the power to restored to gas stations that don't have power. you can't pump gas if you don't have power. power is restored to the terminals to get the fuel, of course, on to the trucks. that's a priority. now, there are trucks moving and there is gas here. the issue are those other two issues really kind of slowing things down and then by the way, we still have some of these huge massive refineries taken off-line trying to get them up
of his more mathematically challenged promises like that $5 trillion in tax cuts or capping federal spending at 20% of the gdp. paul krugman wrote, romney's plan is a sham. it's a list of things he claims will happen with no description of the policies he would follow to make those things happen. if you refuse to let the media ask you questions, you never have to worry about giving them answers. john walsh is editor at large for "salon" and author of "what's the matter with white people." and douglas brinkley is editor of "rolling stone." he conducted an oval office interview with president obama. what do we make of this whole thipg, th thing, this strategy, first of all with you, douglas, this whole idea of a president, it clicks with me as sort of the dewy campaign of 1948 where the guy basically -- as manchester wrote in "the glory and the dream," he had every means of communication to say anything he wanted, and he had nothing to say. also the nixon campaign of '68 where he hunkered down with his big lead and said absolutely nothing, including no interviews. >> i was thinking of
of the opposition group. >>> in south carolina, income tax returns were targeted in the largest cyber attack against the state tax department in american history. more than three million social security numbers were compromised along with more than a million businesses and personal credit and debit cards. >>> the new world series of poker champion is a 24-year-old recovering drug addict and college dropout. greg mercen is from maryland. he won almost 399 hands of texas hold em collecting more than $8.5 million and that piece of bling, a gold championship bracelet worth about $150,000. must be nice. >>> now here's a look at how wall street begins this thursday. the dow closed at 13,096. the s&p 500 was up a fraction. the nasdaq lost ten. taking a look at overseas trading this morning, nikkei gained 18 points, hong kong, the hang seng climbed 180. >>> markets ended october lower but there is good news. they're all way up for 2012. the dow slid 2.5% last month. it is more than 7% this year up. the broader s&p 500 down 2% in october. added, 12.5% in the last ten months. and the nasdaq, the biggest loser
. and the tax return questions i guess, he is probably not going to get from the sportscaster. >> it is the place to go. it is the place where you can have a simulation of an inner view without getting any of the questions. when you build a campaign on distraction it becomes more difficult. it is not new that the politicians try to control the encounters. what we have learned though, he does it more often with more severity than any one one else. there is a pool and that is a group of reporters that go to everything. and they issue pool reports as you well know from your time in politics. mitt romney tried to cut reporters in the pool out of covering his fundraisers. there was such disastrous push back from the press that they had to walk that back. what was that about? it was weird. no republican had tried to do that. now, when they see the types of things that they said. it is wrong. >> the big baug dog at fox news is upset. he agrees with romney on every issue. let's listen to o'reilly complaining about it. >> mitt romney has a story to tell. in my oh pip. he has a story to
-called fiscal cliff that would trigger tax hikes and spending cuts. two short months from now. >>> so, also new this morning, we have president obama picking up another endorsement, though not unexpected. this one coming from the chicago tribune. mitt romney and paul ryan made a joint appearance last night in the battleground state of ohio. >> not just picking a president for four years, we're picking what kind of country we're going to be. what kind of people we're going to be. what kind of country we're going to give to our kids. >> we want real change. we want big change. and paul ryan and i are going to give it to the people of america with your help. >> on the campaign trail today, mitt romney is holding three events in florida, with senator marco rubio, paul ryan's bus tour is crisscrossing ohio. president obama visits new hampshire this afternoon. and vice president biden will attend a rally in lynchburg, virginia. let's get right to it. nbc's mike viqueira is joining us from the white house. good saturday morning to you. >> hi, alex. >> first before we get to this president's trip north
lower tax rates. outsource jobs. they want to let wall street run wild, make reckless bets with other folks' money. >> governor romney campaigning right here in battleground florida alongside senator marco rubio, government headed to his second event of the day in the sunshine state. he addressed voters in pensacola earlier this afternoon. once again, taking it to president obama. >> he promised his would be a post partisan presidency. we've watched him over these last four years and he's been devisive and demonized almost any group that opposed him. >> both governor romney and vice president biden canceled planned trips tomorrow to virginia as hurricane sandy starts to close in there. the governor rescheduling his visit to virginia will campaign instead in the must-win state of ohio. if the buckeye state is governor romney's must-win, same can be said for president obama in pennsylvania where the latest "philadelphia inquirer" poll has the president up by a sizable margin. governor romney has narrowed the lead to six points there. 49-43 in pennsylvania. mitt romney's running mate is
're afraid to go after medicare, medicaid and social security and defense spending and reform taxes to bring more revenue to the federal government, you have to rely on the 11%, 12% of the federal government that is discretionary. so what do you end up doing? since you're not going to tell the truth about having to cut medicare, medicaid, social security, defense spending, you know, reforming the tax code to bring in more revenue to the federal government, you've got to go after fema, which actually fema's not driving us into debt, look at the numbers. you've got to go after big bird, big bird's not driving us into debt, go after -- >> not going after the firefighters -- >> you've got to go where the money is. you rob the banks because that's where the money is. if you want to save america, you have to go where the money is. that's health care, that's medicare, medicaid, social security. you've got to reform them in a way. and i'm not saying voucher systems, this is about math. you've got to reform them in a way that would save those systems, save this country. and then you got to go after d
. because if, indeed, you cut income tax rates by 20%, and you boost defense spending, you've got to -- essentially, you've got to cut discretionary sending, if you're not going to add to the deficit, by a draconian level. you've got to cut it by like 40%, including fema. so, it's impossible to square what we -- again, what we know of his budget plan, since he won't lay them out in detail, and this new statement that, oh, well, of course i'm going to fully fund fema. well, gee, what's he going to say today. of course he loves fema now. but he didn't love it when they were coming up with a budget plan. >> and to eugene's point, if mitt romney thinks he might get some solace from ryan, there's the paul ryan budget, which also slashes any amount, what is it, $23 million from the budget from fema? i mean, again, their actual plans would eviscerate provisions for the kind of plastic surge emergency that this nation is facing today. >> and very shortly, we're going to be discussing whether or not to raise the debt ceiling again. and debt ceilings get pushed out by these kinds of disaste
've suggested they're open to it, is some sort of extension not to the payroll tax cut, but something like that. and, actually, just from the economics -- >> which is the only thing that republicans liked over the sum from the american jobs act. >> that's a good point. that's a correct point, thomas. and, look, as an economist, and i've heard economists of all strikes agree with what i'm about to say. that's actually 120 billion of stimulus. to take that out of the 2013 economy in my view would not be positive for growth. >> my big thanks to our mega power panel for the day. jared bernstein, susan, dana, a big thanks to all of you. >> thank you. >>> starting this weekend, take a peek at this. it's in the process, we turn rockefeller plaza into democracy plaza. it's interactive. we have lots of historic information down there. come down with your kids. i'll be broadcasting live from there on monday. did you know that? no. you see, you learn something every day on this show. msnbc colleagues will be out there every day broadcasting live, so we ask you to come down. >> this is a movie set. we've b
of office, they tried their ideas. we tried giving big tax cuts to the wealthiest americans. we tried giving insurance companies and wall street a free rein to do whatever they play. what we got is falling incomes, record deficits, slowest job growth in 50 years and an economic crisis that we're still cleaning our way out of. so -- so we know what works and we know what doesn't. and governor romney now is a very talented salesman. so in this campaign, he is trying as hard as he can to repackage the same old ideas that didn't work and offer them up as change. he is saying he is the candidate of change, lo and behold. now here is the thing, though. we know what change looks like. and what governor romney is offering ain't it. giving more power to the biggest banks, that's not change. another $5 trillion tax cut to the wealthiest americans, that's not change. refusing to answer details about your policies until after the election, that's definitely not change. we've heard that from politicians before. >> again, a glimpse of the campaign speech the president has been giving to supporters all day
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